Kelso Sturgeon

[navrah]

Now I'm not naive here. However, Kelso's promotional brochure was tempting. I know this guys been around the block. Frankly, a huckster of sort. For the first time in years I hung onto this promotional piece re new book when others heat my home and wondering if any of you have reviewed book?

[George]

Navrah.....like you I get promotional items that sometimes tempt to spend $50 just to find out if there is any possible value in there. Had not thought of using for home heating. Now thats value.

Have not gotten one from Kelso but would include it as one that if it had value, the guy would be using it rather than selling it.

[The Wizard]

Stay away from that SCUM BAG !!!!..........and his friends too like jim feist,vacaro,root and all of the scums out in vegas...........they sell SHIT !!!!!!! and if you ever call 1 of them for anything you got years and years of harrassment coming.............me and a friend of mine signed up for 1 on there football packages some years ago.........there service was lousy and they will call you 5 times a week to get you to sign up for more money.............my buddy had to file harrasment charges against them before they would leave him alone.............So my advice just stay clear of all of them..................like George said if they had something so good they wouldn't be selling it to you for $ 50.00................

[Donnie]

Navrah,
If I remember properly, Kelso at one point used to be a Jock agent (could be wrong but pretty sure that was the case). I have a book written by him and really enjoyed it! It stressed the trainer angle....follow the trainer!! Along with that, he had many good slants that I had not thought of, at least at that time. I would rate it in one of my top 10 favorites I have read. Don't know anything about his latest, but my understanding is that he went into football handicapping and put out a tout sheet for football. I agree with George, if it's a system, I would pass...why sell something that works?? If it's another narrative, as Carl would say, "there may be some nuggets in there somewhere".

Best of Luck!!

[navrah]

Again, regarding the huckster. The book would appear to be about juicing etc.. Based on the reputation he's built he's not getting my $50 until someone reviews. The title "They Fix Horse Races Don't They"? - The story no one wants you to read by the only man who can tell it. That all sounded gooded until the system he's attached that guarantees you some winners or money back......typical huckster. I must admit I love the title. If he could have just stuck with the title maybe more would buy.

[Donnie]

Hey Navrah...just did a quick search and look what I found!!

http://www.kcstar.com/item/pages/printer.pat%2Cfyi/377439e3.211%2C.html

Maybe the second part of that page is more important than the first! (BTW--I love to cook!!)

[Ron]

Navrah;

I'm inclined to think that in a sense all the races ARE fixed .

EG: Each race has a:

Fixed post time.
Fixed post position for each entry.
Fixed conditions for the race.
Fixed distance to be run.
Fixed surface to be run on.
Fixed weight to be carried by the horse.
Fixed starting gate.
Fixed finish line.
Fixed final odds.
Fixed payoffs.

Etc....etc....etc.


Ron

[MikeDee]

In my opnion if I beleved all or most races were fixed I would jsut give this gaem up. The idea that by reading this or any other book that somehow I would be "in the know on the fix" is pretty far fetched. I'll pass on this one.

[navrah]

You folks are making me out to look like a "Ninkenpoop". I prefaced my email to indicate I'm an experienced handicapper. Not some hillbilly from the trailer court (you know, I keep thinking I could sell everything and not have another worry/debt if I bought one-that's another story). No I do not believe the races are fixed. Some try though. That's not the point! However, I know for a fact things go on and there are illegal things that do happen! Let's be real, stuff happens. Now, I'M NOT ASKING FOR A DEBATE ON THIS. IF IT WERE TRUELY MY PREDOMINANT THOUGHT I WOULDN'T BE AT THIS GAME. Forget ALL that and please don't talk down to me! The fricken point is real simple has anyone read the book? We all know that Kelso's a huckster (THAT'S A GIVEN (there is one obvious reason why I haven't bought the book give me some credit)). But, he's been around...and done alot behind the scenes at the track. But he's sold his soul so to say... Don't debate me here because it's true (referring to his knowledge). I like a good read...Mike Helms 2 books on living on the backstretch and living on the KY Farm. Both books had little to do with handicapping just gave you a far deeper appreciation for the game as well as the many available from Exclusivelyequine on breeding, owning, training, etc. I am not looking for an action packed book full of true gems to make me rich/ NONE WILL including Tomcats (no offense to Tomcat). Just wondering if Kelso's guilt caught up to him and wrote some interesting details of his true experiences (hey if the guy is guilty of huckstering in real life, just maybe the guy was the guiltiest behind the scenes-now damnit admit that wouldn't be a good read!). After the fact (after my original posting) did I read the part on making me a winner or refund. However, I'd
still be curious if there is anything interesting in the book based on his extensive experience behind the scenes ?

Navrah
PS I only mention Tomcat due to his affiliation with this site, not a slam or to equate him on par with Kelso!

[Carl]

Navah,

I did read Don's link, doesn't sound to me like at this point Kelso is too into getting it going around horseracing. I can relate to that, and the old boy must be getting up there in years.

Are you sure that this book has actually been written? As in it has a IBIN number, is for sale at GBC, that sort of stuff? Or do you think he is just shopping an idea, and will write the book if there is sufficent interest?

later,
Carl

[fred4now]

What's wrong with trailer courts?

[navrah]

LET"S CALL IT THE END TO THIS THREAD, you know. I know I started it but I'm almost giving the impression I truely give a crap. At this point, I don't give a hoot if the book is any good or not. Truely, I don't give a crap. If it's any good like all things word gets around. Sorry to have wasted space on your bulletin board! Next time, I'll use it for something truely insightful.

Take care
Navrah

[navrah]

Sorry, Fred. Up here in the Midwest they're typically not very desired nor are there residents. Note the word typically. Note the key word, typically! Now I've been to FL and AZ and NV and in a single minute I'd consider scooping up one of these for they are pretty damn nice, affordable as well as there residents. It'd be nice to buy a brand new house for less than one pays for a car:) I meant that in a my previous posting that I'm honestly thinking of buying one in FL as a second residense.

Let's please not continue the Trailer thread....I'm sure some of you live in some nice ones with nice neighbors. I mean no offense

Navrah

[MikeDee]

navrah-
When I read the posts on this thread I don't see a single one that was directed at you. There are posts that mention the author of the book, race fixing in general and personal opinions about whether a person would buy the book or not.

You just asked a question, and people gave an opinion. Once a topic is posted it takes on a life of its' own, and you are lucky if the subject doesn't change in midstream. I think you are taking the replies the wrong way they do not reflect on you.


P.S. Ken Massa may live in a nice neighborhood but the rest of these guys I'm not to sure about;)

[tomcat]

Of course from time to time a race is fixed. That is why they have track detectives and laws to try to protect the public. That is why we test horses after every race. Dishonest racing would kill the sport, and the track industry knows that.

The reason I wrote my book was because of all these %$#@ who promise to make you rich, etc, etc.
My book is an attempt at easy-to-understand-logic on how to save your Gluttius Maximus.

As I said in Vegas, I learned a long time ago in coaching that offense gets the headlines, but defense (a lot of my book) wins championships. Remember, it's only a hobby. The emphasis is not losing money, not trying to get rich.

Would you rather break even or go home a loser?

A day at the races, cashing a couple tickets, having a good time, .... can it get any better than that?

Love you guys

Tomcat:)

[Carl]

Originally posted by navrah
Now I'm not naive here. However, Kelso's promotional brochure was tempting. I know this guys been around the block. Frankly, a huckster of sort. For the first time in years I hung onto this promotional piece re new book when others heat my home and wondering if any of you have reviewed book?

O.K., fair enough.

So I post back "how do you know there's a book at all"?

Then navah ignores my question and gets all offended and posts that he "wants to call an end to this tread"?

Why? Given that you yourself call him "a huckster of sort", I thought it was a legit question about whether the book was actually printed or was a flyer to see if there was any interest first.

So....
1) I did a search at GBC, no such title by Kelso Sturgeon.
2) I did a search at Amazon, no such title by Kelso Sturgeon.

So what's going on? Maybe Donnie (nice link Donnie) and I helped save you $50, and you are mad at us? So what gives navah? What's to be pissed about?

later,
Carl

[Donnie]

I was going to post a poll on "What is up with Navrah?", but I thought that my usual tongue-in-cheek humor would be construed in the wrong way. So I will give one suggestion...try to cut back on the caffinated drinks, go out tonight and take a walk under the stars and look up once in a while and imagine the expanse of the universe. It's amazing what a little peace and quiet can do for the soul. Ohhh it doesn't hurt to take along a glass of wine for the stroll.

Nav, you mentioned the Midwest...what neck of the woods do you live in. Myself, personally, I'm from Iowa, just north of Des Moines. Just another hick.

I need to concur with Mike. I didn't see anyone posting a flame towards you, but something here has gotten you ticked....(I begin to wonder if Nav is actually Kelso, trying to get his "book" published through indirect marketing...things that make you go .."hmmm?". Carl's post got me to thinking!!.)

Carl, you have become quite the bloodhound...wouldn't have thought to look up the book on Amazon or GBC! Computers have definitely made you dangerous!! YIKES!!

I am sure Kenny's home is plush! Maybe the next seminar should be held there...what with the fenced in grounds and the horse-shaped pool!

And last but not least, you know Tomcat, we love you too!!

Peace, all!

[hurrikane]

what do a tornado and a West Virginia divorce have in common?

Some one always loses a trailer.

(sorry Fred, couldn't resist)

[Donnie]

(A hearty laugh from the tornado belt-way of the Midwest!)

[navrah]

Okay, okay, okay....I'm hypersensitive mannn:)

I'll admit....

Let this one cool with the breeze....by the way Carl, I didn't mean to ignore your question. Like I said, I really don't care that much and decided to hopefully discontinue the thread. I seem to have single handidly self perpuated it and now at the mercy of you all to let it die:). Anyways, I have no idea if the book exists (not being snooty, I really don't care that much to find out)...I got the promotional literature, now in the garbage....((he spent alot of money on it....beautiful glossies etc) I guess if one did buy it they're probably embarrassed to admit it), no idea if there's a Library of Congress #. Advertised as a book though it was probably a 2 pg system...you know Kelso!

Take care all

Navrah
(now walking away like a puppy dog)

[fred4now]

That's OK Hurrikane, I don't really live in a trailer park, but I have lived in worse places. Just a little humor. No offense meant Navrah, just thought you needed to lighten up a little bit. Now if only I could get other people to take me seriously, hmmmm