Rail placement at Gulf Stream

[BobD]

It certainly looks the rail placement at GP is leading to different race profiles. It seems consistent with common sense but early speed is tough to catch when the rail is out at 72 feet and the outside posts are really up against it.

I don't see the rail placement on any of the chart information and the basis stats are for all turf races by distance.

Can you capture this in the data somewhere and add the rail placement to the stats?

[tbrown]

Grab the rail data from the comma charts.

[km]

Bob

That's an excellent observation. As Tbrown, relates, it can be separated in a db using our comma delimited chart download. The PPQ screen in HTR2 has rail placement in the PPs (ie "r72" next to the track condtion)

It is also noted in our Chart text files.

That leads me to believe it may be possible to insert it into our regular data file, in which case I could add into the Robot for testing with a range filter. I'll check the data specs and find out more from HDW if necessary.

[BobD]

Ken,

Thanks for the reply but, following up I took a look at the PPQ information and all I saw was "run up" (ru60) comments no "r72" type. Is it possible that the starting gate positioning and run up correlates to a specific rail placement at a specific distance?


Bob

[DanG]

Ken,

Thanks for the reply but, following up I took a look at the PPQ information and all I saw was "run up" (ru60) comments no "r72" type. Is it possible that the starting gate positioning and run up correlates to a specific rail placement at a specific distance?

Bob
Bob; the Temp rails are in the ‘track condition column’ next to distance. However; if the turf was not firm “fm”, it shows the course condition and not the rail placement. If the rails were down; it just displays fm, yl or whatever. It's early; I hope I explained that right. :)

Example:

#070 Su 21Nov10__9AQU 8.5T R9 096 3uF NW1 23.7 49.0 114.0 144.6 77 09 6-4½ 6-4½ 9-6½ 10-8¼ 62 27.0 Lb Ribaud|Graci saved ground, faded 10 AQU1121C.TXT09
126 Su 26Sep10 4BELi 8.5T R27 093 3uF NW1 24.5 49.7 114.1 143.4 70 07 10-8½ 10-9½ 10-8½ 10-4½ 62 9.3 Lb Ribaud|Graci stumbled brk, trail 10 BEL0926C.TXT04
163 Fr 20Aug10 5SARi 8.5T R18 095 3uF NW1 24.6 48.2 113.0 142.3 75 08 9-9½ 9-6¾ 9-6¾ 8-7¾ 60 8.0 Lb Ribaud|Garci 4w into lane,no thr 09 SAR0820C.TXT05
182 Su 01Aug10__6SARi 8.5T R9 095 3uF NW1 23.2 47.6 112.6 141.9 73 08 10-8½ 10-10 11-7¼ 9-6 62 7.8 Lb Ribaud|Velas 5w into str, no kic 11 SAR0801C.TXT06
232 Sa 12Jun10 9CD 9.0T gd 099 3yF GR3 24.0 48.3 113.4 152.0 83 09 9-14 7-4 3-½ 3-1½ 80 49.9 Lb Sanner|Herna 4-5, drifted in, ga 12 CD0612C.TXT 09
260 Sa 15May10 9CD 9.0T fm 097 3uF NW1 24.0 48.7 113.6 150.6 78 07 8-5¼ 6-3 2-2 3-3 73 42.0 Lb Sanner|Herna 5 wide middle move 11 CD0515C.TXT 09
284 We 21Apr10 6KEE 9.0T fm 094 3yF NW1 23.4 47.7 112.3 149.5 72 05 6-2½ 6-2¼ 4-3 3-6½ 61 29.6 Lb Sanner|Bridg 5 wide, steady adva 09 KEE0421C.TXT06
297 Th 08Apr10 9KEE 8.0T R15 094 3yF NW1 23.5 47.4 111.9 136.3 71 03» 9-12 10-11 8-13 8-12 49 49.8 L Sanner|Lebro no factor 10 KEE0408C.TXT09
.................................................. .

[del_dog]

Could we use a 1 character track condition and have the rail be the other 2 characters?

F27
s72
F0

etc.

[DanG]

Could we use a 1 character track condition and have the rail be the other 2 characters?

F27
s72
F0

etc.
You would get occasional overlap with (frozen / fast, and slow / sloppy)

Surf Cond Full Cond Abv
Dirt fr Frozen f*
Dirt FT Fast f*
Dirt gd Good g
Dirt hy Heavy h
Dirt my Muddy m
Dirt sl Slow s*
Dirt SY Sloppy s*
Dirt wf Wet Fst w
Turf fm Firm f
Turf gd Good g
Turf hd Hard h
Turf sf Soft s
Turf yl Yielding y

[del_dog]

for just turf races...............??

[ejt2112]

It is early, but isn't this just an issue with the turf courses?
The rail doesn't move on the dirt anywhere to my knowledge.
If it was changed to a 3 letter code. 1st character is turf condition.
2nd and 3rd character are feet from rail.

[DanG]

It is early, but isn't this just an issue with the turf courses?
The rail doesn't move on the dirt anywhere to my knowledge.
If it was changed to a 3 letter code. 1st character is turf condition.
2nd and 3rd character are feet from rail.

Sorry!

I warned you guys it was early; and I was out very late!!! :eek: :D

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_noSTbv355Zk/TS4m0pSIPoI/AAAAAAAAAfI/_Y-_qSnREug/s1600/homer-doh-square.jpeg

[km]

I emailed Ron at HDW and asked if the rail placement was available pre-race data. If it is, then I can list it in the header and create a filter in Robot2. It is already in the comma delimited charts file for db users.

As far as the PPs, Dan is right, if the rail position is shown next to the distance , the Turf was Firm. If the Turf not firm, then hit the <c> key to look at the chart and see what the full condtions were, including rail position (if any), the weather and the track condition.

[km]

No good on the rail placement before the race, so there is nothing i can do pre-race or in the Robot for spot plays. I might be able to extract it from the Chart though for post race testing.

This response from Ron at HDW =

Rail is not available from Equibase before the race - it is sometimes a last minute decision, depending on weather and track conditions. It is not even a data element in the pre-race database for that reason - just post race data.

[OPM]

Honestly, this is pretty ridiculous that they can't decide on rail position until day of race, look, you know what the condition of the turf course is way in advance. If it rains a lot , the races come off the turf, simple.
At least, they are changing the position of the starting gate with the different rail position but does this mess up our velocity ratings since the tele-timer positions are fixed?

[km]

The compounded velocity, S/P and A/P are not affected much by screwed up timing, rails or run ups. Individual times and fracitons and even final time ratings can be way off though. Whacky early fractions like 26.0 - 49.0 are not uncommon when the rails are up. That will mess up the Fr1-Fr2 ratio, but A/P, E/P and S/P smooth it out.